Posts by Cold Steel

34

What do you think is the source of your consciousness? Can it be copied or transferred?

by EndofMysteries in

this seems to be a question that even scientifically is still in the air.

right now your consciousness, is it the physical part of the brain?

the electrical signals in the brain?

Cold Steel

Cofty: Mormon cult gibberish.

Y'know, Cofty, your lack of substance is more than made up for by your childish oblique. As someone once said, abuse is a weapon of the vulgar.

34

What do you think is the source of your consciousness? Can it be copied or transferred?

by EndofMysteries in

this seems to be a question that even scientifically is still in the air.

right now your consciousness, is it the physical part of the brain?

the electrical signals in the brain?

In my belief system, intelligence is what you're referring to. As I understand and believe, intelligence is eternal. It is one of two elements that exist in the Cosmos. The other is matter. One acts and the other is acted upon. Intelligence comes in many grades and is co-eternal with God. We all existed as intelligences before we were spirits, and we all were spirits before we were flesh, and because of Christ we will be resurrected as perfect physical beings of great power and glory -- but not all will be equal. In other words, intelligence cannot be created nor destroyed. Animals aren't as intelligent as humans, and cats are more intelligent than dogs. It's just the way things are. Even humans differ in intelligence just as celestial bodies differ from terrestrial bodies.

That said, artificial intelligence apes real intelligence, but it can't feel, nor does it have (nor can it be made to have) self awareness. It would be a fascinating field if intelligence could be created in a laboratory, but it can't. That doesn't mean we should stop studying and building upon artificial intelligence, as I believe it holds great potential, but intelligence is more than code. Code reacts predictably to input unless it is written to react randomly. Intelligence often reacts randomly, but not because of code; it's frequently unpredictable and irrational. Yet it can learn from experience. Code can try one thing, then another, and can even predict, but it can't feel. It can't be guided by emotion such as fear or love no matter how well you can program.

My religious views are my own and I certainlyI can't prove them. But my non-religious views, above, are surely open to debate. If you haven't read it, I recommend a book entitled What Is Intelligence? by James R. Flynn. One of the things he reports is that real intelligence, flawed by our physical limitations, is yet capable of great expansion and growth. Humans, for example, can be motivated to progress. Our experiences and how we respond to them mold us into who we are, which may be why we're here. Code can't improve or progress, nor form opinions. Flynn notes: "If people have adopted the language of science and use logic and the hypothetical freely, why do so many of them believe nonsense about the Loch Ness monster, flying saucers, astrology and so forth? The answer is that scientific language and abstract argument can be used just as easily to defend nonsense as sense.... The vocabulary and habits of mind fostered by science do not automatically engender critical acumen or wisdom. They provide a foundation but much has to be done to build a temple of reason on that foundation."

So I suppose that's why there are so many religions and personal beliefs in the world. Atheists think religionists are nuts and religionists, in many cases, consign atheists to a neverending hell because they don't believe as they do. There are Muslims, Mormons, Methodists, Mennonites and many other beliefs. And I don't believe code can ever form criteria enough to form any sort of opinion. Even Flynn calls "flying saucers" "nonsense" when many intelligent people, including highly trained NASA astronauts, believe in them.

34

The Jehovah's Witnesses' Governing Body are Elitists (Here is why)

by Terry in

an "elite" group is one which has special privileges not granted to others.. and obscurantist elite, is a group which hides information by virtue of its own claim to be special and a sole source in dispensing necessary truths.. to wit:.

the gb's elitism shines through in articles such as this:.

“thus the bible is an organizational book and belongs to the christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals , regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the bible .

Cold Steel

Members of the Governing Body like to think of themselves as akin to the Quorum of the Twelve in ancient days.

Of course there are just a few differences:

The apostles were called and ordained by Jesus Christ
They were given the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven and thus could bind on heaven and earth
The first Twelve will judge the Twelve Tribes of Israel, and the following apostles will be judges under them

When the WTS disfellowships a person, the assumption is made that if that person dies in an excommunicated state, or condition, that the cutting off will be recognized by God and they will be deresurrected at the judgment. This infers that the WTS has the ability to bind and loose, and that if they do it here, it will be an action that's honored by God in Heaven. (Otherwise why sweat it?) But when were the GB members called? And who laid hands upon them to give them the power? "For you have not chosen me, but I have chosen you and ordained you," the Lord said to them. Did he ordain the members of the GB? Not that we know of. Have they had visions, entertained angels, been taken into Heaven and seen unspeakable things? Yet the least of the GB members is greater than John the Baptist, one of the greatest prophets who ever lived.

In my view they have elevated themselves higher than Nimrod ever imagined. So don't be surprised if what they say is elevated as well.

3

👑 He Who Is Least In The Kingdom of Heaven....

by Cold Steel in

jesus said that of all those born of women, none were greater than john the baptist.

nevertheless, he added, he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

universally nearly all scholars have taken this to mean that because jesus had taken upon himself the sins of the world, he had the last claim upon the kingdom of heaven.

Cold Steel

Jesus said that of all those born of women, none were greater than John the Baptist. Nevertheless, he added, he who is least in the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than he.

Universally nearly all scholars have taken this to mean that because Jesus had taken upon himself the sins of the world, he had the last claim upon the Kingdom of Heaven. But because he was perfect and without sin, he was greater than John. Jesus also said the greatest of all is the servant of all. He, being the greatest of all, is the servant of all in that he died for us and brought salvation to all men.

Now the WTS has the strange doctrine that because John the Baptist isn't of the Heavenly Class, those who are, even the least of them, will be greater than John. This means that every member of the Governing Body is greater than John. Even Aunt Edna, who takes the Memorial emblems each year, is greater than John the Baptist, one of the greatest prophets of all time.

To those of you who are still active, does this really make sense?

24

"You don't go to church in a Kingdom Hall"

by stephanie61092 in

"you don't go to church in a kingdom hall" was stated during the public talk yesterday.

the speaker then elaborated that "people who go to church, go to fulfill a spiritual obligation.

coming to the kingdom hall is coming to learn.

Cold Steel

The only engaging process is when people raise their hands to answer questions with underlined answers straight from the material, maybe with a little personal flair.

What would happen if one did raise questions that were a little tougher to answer? I assume you can ask questions freely there, can't you? Don't you ever have any investigators attend? What questions would be considered inappropriate to ask? From what little I understand, members feel pretty free to counsel other members, even when not asked for their input.

What kind of questions could get one into trouble?

20

How can Jesus be the head of the Jehovah's Witnesses

by Watchtower-Free in

.

Cold Steel

It actually goes beyond that.

Can any man-made church be the church of Jesus Christ? As far as I know, no one in the WTBTS ever had any vision or commandment of God to establish it, nor do any of them claim revelation from God. So how would any of its Governing Body ever know whether they were teaching the truth or if they had the authority to act in God's name? You have the soul sleeping doctrine, the blood transfusion doctrine, the bizarre Armageddon exegesis, just to name a few. Then you look at the Church Jesus built. Apostles, prophets, priests, elders, bishops, deacons, teachers, seventy and so forth. Does the WTS have these? Finally, who ordained JW elders, overseers, the GB members? Where did they receive the direction and the ability to baptize or judge the people under their charge? To go door-to-door and tell people that they have the power and the keys to bind in Heaven and Earth takes a great deal of presumption in my view. Or to teach the gospel without being sent. Or to call other churches man-made?

I've got to hand it to them. It takes guts to appoint one's self to assume (and I do mean assume) the authority to represent God when you haven't heard even a peep from Him. At that day when we all stand before God to be judged, I'm not sure I'd know how to answer Him when asked by what authority I assumed to act in His name or dared to represent Him to others, break up families in His name and to stand as judges in Israel. But I'd try to get my story straight before then.

11

Help to build a "Guide to Your New Faith"

by Defianttruth in

i have seen many people ask the question, "if its not the truth what else is there?

" i imagine that most people want to remain in a christian faith so i want to build a matrix for one to use as a guide in finding a new church if he or she feels a need to worship.

i personally don't attend any church and i will keep my personal beliefs to myself.

Cold Steel

If you find a church that condemns people to hell because of what they believe or disbelieve, you might want to look elsewhere. If they feel like all Jews will suffer in a fiery, neverending hell because they don't believe in Jesus, you might also want to give them a pass.

Of all the JW doctrines, which would you keep and which would you deep-six? I assume the JW version of Armageddon would be on the chopping block. But how about soul sleeping? The resurrection? Trinity? Hell? Futurism? (The dispersion and gathering of Judah, the building of the third Jewish temple, the coming of Gog from the north, the two prophets, second coming, millennial reign.)

8

Masons, Tomas Jefferson, Jesus, ancient Egyptian religion, Russell

by Crazyguy in

i believe the masons we're anti christs, tomas jefferson i read even wrote a bible leaving out anything to do with jesus because these masons new the christ was just a retelling of older god's, some of these gods being from the egyptian religion.. russell was said to be a mason and it's interesting that he traveled to egypt to confirm some of his beliefs.

then after he returns home his religion becomes more like that of the ancient egyptian religion then probably any other christians sect.

like the egyptians the jws believe in a two class system one class goes to heaven to be with god, just like the pharaoh's and the other rank and file class goes to a paradise called the field of reeds.

Cold Steel

Free Masons have been badly maligned as "occult" and satanic. You also hear about the use of the pyramid, the all-seeing eye, inverted pentagram and other symbols being used in Satan worship. But many of these symbols were only degraded in recent years. The inverted star was used by ancient Christians and can be found in many ancient churches dating back to the 1200s.

The Masons' all-seeing eye represents the omniscience of God. The use of the pyramid is not a masonic symbol, but the triangle is. But even if it were a masonic symbol, pyramids are found all over the world (such as Egypt, Greece, Spain, the Americas (North and South), Tibet, Vietnam, China, etc.) and are seen as architectural marvels. In fact, all the symbols of free masonry that I've been able to find represent good, decent, honorable and desirable traits and goals. There are no occult, satanic, lecherous, lazy, untruthful or dishonorable teachings and many great men in U.S. history have been Masons.

There are many symbols that were once good that are now seen as evil because they've been adopted by unholy and unimaginative groups like the Church of Satan.

13

Forgiveness Yesterday, Today and Forever

by Cold Steel in

i was just watching the jw broadcasting network and the topic being discussed was forgiveness.

the fellow presenting the topic was talking a brother who had sinned many years ago.

he finally came clean with the local elders, accepted his discipline and got on with his life.

Cold Steel

I think journalism has gone to hell these days in that stories seem to be thrown together from various sources into a template of some kind. I may not be a JW, but if the man's religion is important enough to mention in the story and the headline, it begs the question of whether he was born a JW or converted, and if the latter when and why. If he was baptized after his killings, I think it would be a great story.

The article also indicates that Sutcliffe believes he's on his last leg and isn't long for this world.

What would really be ironic is that Armageddon comes and Sutcliffe is saved by Jehovah, while those 13 women he murdered are resurrected, then annihilated because they were worldly and weren't JWs! What a hoot that would be. BTW, you said they'd changed their views on Armageddon. How so?

13

Forgiveness Yesterday, Today and Forever

by Cold Steel in

i was just watching the jw broadcasting network and the topic being discussed was forgiveness.

the fellow presenting the topic was talking a brother who had sinned many years ago.

he finally came clean with the local elders, accepted his discipline and got on with his life.

Cold Steel

And yes, the witnesses baptize convicted and suspected murderers. They have special assigned brothers who study with prisoners.

Do you (or anyone else here) know anyone who's worked with convicts, especially convicted murderers?

Years ago, I did a series of articles on capital punishment. One of that series involved interviewing people on death row. Coincidentally they were all innocent, even the guy who left church a few minutes early and shot and killed three people in front of almost the entire congregation! He'd been on death row for years and if I hadn't been familiar with his case, I think he might have convinced me. Anyway, nearly all of these guys had Bibles in their cells and read them...religiously. So I wonder if someone on death row could be baptized into the WTS?

Another thing, if I understand JW doctrine correctly, can't someone repent at the time of resurrection? One of the publishers back in the 70s told me that all those who are alive at Armageddon will be able to choose between Satan and Jehovah -- and those who side with Jehovah will be saved. Based on what I've heard since leads me to think that's not entirely true. But if a murderer is executed, then comes forth in the resurrection, will he be saved if he's had a complete change of heart?